55. Jon Tilley: Using ChatGPT To Write Amazon Listings In Minutes

Ben Donovan  00:00
Hi, folks, welcome back to another episode of The Brand Builder show. And today’s episode is I always say it, but it’s gonna be another great episode. This is a show where we like to bring you latest trending strategies, and today is going to be no different. We’ve got John Tilley on the show with us today. John, welcome to the show.
 
Jon Tilley  00:18
Ben, good to be here, man.
 
Ben Donovan  00:20
Good to have you. It’s your first time only been on on the show before a while back. But it’s great to have you back to talk about a trending topic. And we’re going to be talking about artificial intelligence feels like the whole world is talking about it right now. So we’re going to join with them. You’ve got some exciting developments happening on your end, which we’re going to get into for the people that maybe haven’t heard the episode before. not heard much about you. Tell us who you are, where you’re from, give us the elevator pitch of your life. And and we’ll get started.
 
Jon Tilley  00:52
You know, being you’re being a game has upped its game since we last met so good. Anyway, yeah, it’s uh, for those who don’t know me, I’m John Tilley, originally from South Africa, had a long career in advertising, kind of as a strategic account exec and find my way with that to London. So I live in London and work with some big agencies there and then find my way all the way over to Los Angeles, where I continued in that path. But this is 2006 When I was in Los Angeles, but But after that, I launched a few private label brands in 2015, as a lot of us did, at the time, and and through that process, you know, really saw the opportunity to to start a software company around data intelligence for private label Amazon sellers, specifically. So I launched that in 2016 called Zon Guru. So I’m the co founder and CEO of Zon Guru. And really, we’re an operational tool set for brands that sell on Amazon. So you know, this is specific to private label sellers who have their own brands, but but also now in today’s age agencies and big enterprise brands that are really looking for scalability, on on, on Amazon. So we have about 17, or I think it’s 18 different tools now, at kind of each area of the operational part of your Amazon business. And we help you scale through automation in North America, Europe, Australia, and India on the marketplace we connected with so yeah, there was like there was a long elevator pitch, but
 
Ben Donovan  02:28
now it’s good. It’s good. And we’re going to talk about one of those tools. It’s had some some updates, specifically around artefill artificial intelligence. In a moment if anybody wants to hear more about the whole Eurozone goo journey and stuff we did do dig into that a bit more in our previous episode. So we’ll leave that link below in the description for people to check out. But before we do dive into the topic, AI Chat GPTT writing listings the future of robots taking over the world, we do just want to do our traditional, I say traditional, we’re about four episodes into doing it. But the favorite five section just asking you what your favorites are on five key topics that a lot of our listeners will be interested in. Number one, give us some inspiration on your favorite ecommerce brand.
 
Jon Tilley  03:16
I know it’s all related to Valentine’s Day, because today’s valentine’s day I’m sharing this moment with you whether No, no, I think interesting there. There’s many but I think the one of late especially in the US is probably liquid death. I don’t know if you if you know that brand. Well, but you know, it’s essentially water can. But it started as E commerce brand. And, you know, they’re branded and liquid death. And, you know, I was looking at it the other day and I was like, Why do they call it liquid death. And the story behind it is really, you know, it was a Netflix director who started this brand and he had been going to a lot of concerts and you know, all the rockers had their their their red balls and everything on stage. But there was never they actually preferred water but there was never really anything that kind of was you know, within that genre for for rock stars and athletes etc. Where you know, water is typically like this nice, beautiful bubble and they wanted like a rock bottle, you know, and liquid death is really you know, that is what you know what it gives you life but you know, it can also be extreme right with it, whether you’re doing extreme sports or something, it can get pretty dangerous. So that was a cool name. And they launched it through video online and we’ve got traction and is a massive e commerce brand that is now sold in retail but But it started on on on ecommerce. And I think it’s worth 500 million at the moment. And they did 45 million in revenue, like last year just with rebranding water. So it’s like, wow, like it is it’s just such a cool concept where you know, brand and differentiation is truly what makes something scalable. Right. And we’ve got to really pay attention to that because if you can get that right, it’s, you know, the world’s oyster.
 
Ben Donovan  04:58
Yeah, absolutely. It’s a masterclass in branding liquid death, they are half a billion dollars company, you know selling water crazy. But no great answer. Okay, next one up is your favorite software or tool that helps you run your business or your life?
 
Jon Tilley  05:17
Oh, I probably say I’d probably say notion notion is from a business perspective, one that we use a lot. There’s different different software’s out there, we use notion. It’s really like an internal Wikipedia that allows us to develop SOPs that are accessed by the whole organization. And if you’re truly trying to scale, you know, having a good SOP for SOPs in a central place for for capturing that it’s critical whether you’re building a software company or even your own Amazon ecommerce brand or E commerce brand that you want to sell one sell one day if you have SOPs done, it’s it’s gonna change your life for sure. So
 
Ben Donovan  05:56
yeah, nice, man. Yeah, we’re just diving deep into it. Now. I’ve had loads of people say it recently. And I’m trying to consolidate a bunch of different tools into it, including like project management, which is a bit of a task in itself. But But no, I’m loving it so far. It’s a crazy powerful tool. So definitely
 
Jon Tilley  06:14
one of the guys on our team. I think he did an exercise a year ago of actually running running his life through a notion documents. So yeah, like the SOP that is in urgent I was like, okay, that’s extreme. But anyway, you know, one way to learn how to use that tool,
 
Ben Donovan  06:32
one thing, one thing, removing yourself from your business, but you don’t want to remove yourself from your life. Good stuff. Okay. Next up favorite organic marketing channel.
 
Jon Tilley  06:47
Yeah, I would, I would probably say, my favorite that we’re going with right now is kind of blog content, I would say is organic. You know, it’s an interesting space. And even with AI right now, it’s pretty interesting. You know, seeing how people can get it wrong. But that’s working really well for us.
 
Ben Donovan  07:05
Yeah, yeah, definitely. And what about a paid marketing channel?
 
Jon Tilley  07:12
I mean, ours is 100%. It’s going to be Google ads. You know, that’s, that’s, that’s what drives invoice price. And it’s very specific. And it works really well for us. So paid, I would say that France, we’re playing a lot with YouTube right now. But the biggest driver is still good old Google.
 
Ben Donovan  07:29
Yeah. Nice. Good. And then final one, your favorite business book?
 
Jon Tilley  07:34
Oh, I gotta go with traction traction is, you know, we still involve that in our day to day at work and setting slingshots and goals and, you know, scaling and getting traction momentum and breaking it down to specific daily goals. And writing that up into monthly and obviously annual and the five year vision is critical writing, keeping the team aligned. So traction is great to be on. Go for it.
 
Ben Donovan  08:00
Is traction, the original about EOS, or is that  Yeah definitely. Yeah. Recommended read for any entrepreneur. EOS is the Entrepreneurial Operating System, I think, and they give you like a structure of how to run a company here. It’s really good. Very good. Good. Okeydoke. All right. Well, let’s thank you. For those. It’s good. I just love those. I think it’s insightful for people to hear, you know, your thoughts on that. And it always gives recommendations for people to go away and, and research, the more and more stuff. So thank you for humoring me on that one. Let’s talk about AI then, you know, what in the world is going on there? Everyone’s talking about AI. I did an episode a couple of weeks ago with someone about, you know, AI and everything that’s going on, and just continues to be the top of everyone’s mind. I thought it might die down. But you know, Google the other day just released their you know, bod, it’s like the hair competitor to suppose that competitor to ChatGPT is so much, you know, changing and people not really knowing at the end of the day where this is all going to land. But just before he enters sort of specifics on Amazon, what’s your take on all of this?
 
Jon Tilley  08:04
yes, yeah.  Yeah. So talk about an epic fail with bought, I don’t know if you follow the story there, but they did launch and got it completely wrong. I think the share price dropped dramatically on LTVs. Right, so
 
Ben Donovan  09:22
what 200 billion off their value or something
 
Jon Tilley  09:24
ridiculous. A little bit. So yeah, they got an epic fail. Of 2023. Yeah, look, you know, AI is not anything new. I mean, it’s since the start of the internet. That’s really what drives it a half half of our intelligence in enzyme news or, you know, AI and and you’re building an intelligence, you know, kind of bite. That’s the day’s tasks for you. So there’s nothing new about that. But I think where the change has come starting with ChatGPT is really about putting in a process that brings AI into our daily lives. That’s right. And I think this is this is a moment, right that you look back on the history and you’re like, okay, cool, there’s the dot com era, you know, there was there was, you know, even things like Uber, which, which, you know, in our everyday consumer lives, you know, they change our habits. And I think ChatGPT has now taken AI into, you know, the direct, you know, consumer world, right, where we’re simply, you know, you can literally, it’s taken away any kind of programming aspects, you can type something into ChatGPT, and then it will perform specific functions that you asked you to do, and it does it very well. So, you know, I think this is something that we will see in every aspect of our lives moving forward. And you know, where that goes, it’s, it’s very interesting and fascinating, and it’s very scary at the same time, you know, how are we going to navigate this, but it’s a tool you’re going to get very used to, and it’s, it’s just the start of where things are going. So, you know, when when I saw ChatGPT launched in December, November, December, and I saw what I was doing, I was like, Okay, this is a moment, this is going to be one of those moments where it’s going to change our everyday life in a number of a number of aspects, you know, from everything that we do. And so we jumped on that immediately and started reading, kind of, with skepticism going in and testing and seeing, you know, is this something that we should we should use? You know, we’re specifically on Amazon, but clearly, this is something that that, you know, we will use in everyday lives for a number of different functions. It’s literally a virtual assistant that can do, you know, you know, complex tasks, with a lot of information extremely fast.
 
Ben Donovan  11:32
Yeah, there’s obviously a lot of positives with it. But do you see any negatives?
 
Jon Tilley  11:41
Yeah, I mean, I do see negatives, I think that the big thing that people are fearful of is like, is that a job? replacer? Right. And I think I think humans generally, will get fearful of things like this and say, oh, you know, it’s, it’s replacing, you know, I don’t know, it’s replacing a legal analyst who needs to analyze a bunch of documents or something, you know, but but, you know, and surely, it’s going to be used in a number of ways that are not positive, I think I think already there’s, there’s a bunch of software that’s been invented to detect AI rights and how it’s being used, and it can be used, you know, when you see someone speaking on on a, you know, on a video, it’s, it absolutely can be AI, trained to speak in their voice to look like them, right. So, you know, being able to detect detect, whether that’s real or not, is going to be critical. And I think it can, it’s going to be used in a lot of negative ways, for sure. But out of that, there’s going to be born in industry, that that will help to protect that. And I think at the end of the day, with all technology, and this, this one, you know, doesn’t doesn’t change that is that pushes us as humans to focus on, you know, our craft, our expertise, our creativity, right, as a human, which is, which is irreplaceable, you can’t replace that with with some kind of AI. But at least at this point, you know, when when singularity or whatever happens down the road, maybe maybe it will, but at this point in time, you know, the human brain is thought, you know, with with the experience that we can build is there’s a creative aspect that just can’t be replaced. So, you know, I see AI at the moment as an additive in this technology to, to moving quickly with some tasks, but it doesn’t replace, you know, how, you know, how you take that and how you use that as an expert in your true craft in a creative way. And that that’s what we should be focusing on as humans, right? Not just the day to day mundane, right?
 
Ben Donovan  13:37
Yeah, definitely. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the whole world of AI tools is nothing crazy new, as you said, it’s been like, since the dawn of Internet has been some form of it. You know, for the last year or so we’ve been playing around with some content creation type stuff, you know, with AI, that’s definitely helps speed up the workflow. But there’s no way that it can fully replace the knowledge that you need, especially as we get on to talk about, you know, Amazon products, there’s, there’s a lot of legwork that can be done by it. And it’s, you know, obviously, I don’t want to answer the question that I asked you. But at the end of the day, I think a lot of it is going to be optimizing workflow and giving you room and space to then be able to focus on more of the stuff that matters. And so for Amazon sellers, obviously, that’s a big focus and a big, you know, key for them, because we build these businesses because they are streamlined because they can be incredibly lean. And this is another example of how someone can create even more of a lean business by, like you said, using this as a bit of an assistant. So how before we get on to like the specifics of what Zon Guru’s doing, because, you know, really excited about that. But But what kinds of things do you see Amazon sellers using something like ChatGPT for is it just for writing copy or is there you know, are there options possibilities beyond that, do you think?
 
Jon Tilley  14:59
Yeah, I mean, possibilities are endless, right? Because you could tell it to take a specific piece of content and put it into a table and format it for, you know, an Excel spreadsheet or whatever you want it to tell it to do. So, you know, just, and we’ve done this, traditionally as Amazon sellers all, you know, think of, what’s the first thing that you do as an Amazon seller, when you start to sell a bunch of products, you hire your first VA, right? Your first virtual assistant, and you’re like, okay, my virtual assistant is going to, you know, manage my customer reviews, or my responses to that, or, or doing some product research or handling, you know, finding the best suppliers or whatever you whatever is that admin tasks that you that you want your virtual assistant to do you hire, then you build that into your business, right. And the point of doing that to exactly what you said earlier is, you know, you don’t want to be stuck in your business, you want to be, you know, running your business. And this idea of, it’s a vital skill set that us as entrepreneurs have to learn which is, which is you don’t want to be the, the person in the orchestra, you want to be the conductor, right. So you want to be able to have the ability to manage a team or delegate, or showcase people what to do as much as possible. So you’re not stuck in the details of it. And you can have the vision of where you need to take your business and have the space to have the vision and that’s critical for Amazon sellers. I mean, it’s critical for for us as leaders in our business to, to not get stuck in all of those tasks, right, and to have the space to grow their business and, and navigate where you’re going. So, you know ChatGPT is certainly something that can do a lot of those tasks, right. And I’m not going to say I know, David and enough to chat to be to know exactly how it can be used in every single way. There’s people on our team that do it, but and are using it in their daily life. But certainly from from an Amazon seller perspective, you know, some of those VA tasks, you can get ChatGPT to do it, whether you sign up and and use it directly with them, or whether you use it inside of a software, like what we’re doing, but it’s going to automate a lot of those processes and give you you know, yeah, maybe automate all of it. But it certainly gives you an amazing baseline that when you truly put your focus on that specific piece of the business, you can put your best into it in the shortest amount of time, which is critical.
 
Ben Donovan  17:19
Yeah, definitely. You mentioned about, you know, November, December time, kind of as it began to really take off, you start to then look at how you can integrate this into Zon Guru, what you’re doing with the tools there, how as that process develops, can you talk us through like the timeline of what you’ve been developing? And then into what’s up? And available now? And then give us a bit of a demo of it?
 
Jon Tilley  17:41
Yeah, sure. You know, when it came out, I think, you know, I obviously, you noticed that, and I was like, Okay, this is going to be something we need to spend some time on this. And, you know, I called the team brainstorm with the engineers and had a product and I think the initial reaction was was a lot of pushback. Because we clearly we’ve got like a, you know, we’ve got a serious roadmap that we’re all focused on with, with it with a, you know, as leaner team as we can to build all of the tools we’re doing. So just another harebrained idea from John because thrown in the mix, to to mess things up. wasn’t wasn’t appreciated, right? But, you know, I was persistent, they say, let’s say, and we had a brainstorm. And I was like, let’s just have a look at this. Let’s see. Yeah, it’s just spend an hour, you know, come on, and we spent an hour and it’s and there was a lot of skepticism, but I think once we, we tested a few of the outputs from from AI, just with generally just using the website. The guys were starting to say, hey, there’s something here, right. And we’re impressed with with what, what was coming back from the in the intelligence of ChatGPT? And I think, you know, the beauty of that is that when you one of our highest values is it’s all our highest value is curiosity, right? I think anybody that we hire on our team, we want to we want to make sure that they have an innate curiosity to to kind of go off to things right and I think the team just got curious about it. They ran ran off of that like, like, you know, spinning her, you know, putting your life into notion like just being curious about things. So you know, the guys the guys you know, did that there they got really curious with with ChatGPT and thought about how we can use it and, you know, clearly one of the easiest or first my easiest, I would say, the first place that we that we thought I’m an application for this was around content creation for you know, for, you know, for for your listing on Amazon, right. I think I think I did my, my end of year, December. email to our customers. I wrote it obviously from me, but then I actually took that and threw that into ChatGPT and included that as a as a version on on the email, right? So hey, there’s if if ChatGPT, we try this, we’re there, right? And it was much more succinct, succinct and professional. But it took all the emotion out of it. Right. So that was as a sidebar. But I think that obviously, you know, it’s that was the first place that people started to pay attention to is how to how to, what does it do with content? And how can I do that. So that’s where we started and went in with, you know, skepticism to say, a can it, can as truly make a difference. But if it can, and this is something we need to jump on to, and that’s where we started.
 
Ben Donovan  20:31
Yeah, I’ve noticed that it is one of the biggest things it saves time on, you mentioned about being succinct and you can set it condensed and everything. One of the hardest things about writing content is, you know, just choosing the right words, there’s going to not be wofully, but communicate the message you’re trying to communicate. And it’s not knowing what to say, because, you know, what you’re trying to communicate is actually forming that into cohesive sentences. That’s where the hard work is. And that’s where I found AI is the most significant help, you know, is because it cuts down that the workload on that, if that makes sense. So
 
Jon Tilley  21:10
yeah, yeah. 100%. And that’s, that’s the important thing to get across. Yeah, for for everyone is like, you know, it’s moving you from, from content, writing from scratch into, into content editing, it’s giving you that starting point, right, that baseline, and all that stuff, like writer’s block, how do we start? I know what I want to say, but how do I say it, you know, it’s much easier to say, Hey, give me a baseline, you know, and then we work from there, and see, see if I can get that to work, and then finesse it further than just starting from scratch. And, and more importantly, especially for Amazon content, it’s, it’s not only like, Hey, I know what I want to say, and I want to say it concisely or in a certain tone, or, you know, for my, for my brand, or whatever it is, but you need to write those those words in a way that it’s optimized for the algorithms, right. So that, that it’s concisely written, but it’s exact phrase broad match in the right way, for the main specific terms of what you’re trying to optimize for. And that’s the most critical piece, right? And if you can get the AI to do that, I mean, now you’ve got like a concise, you know, well written piece that is well optimized for the Amazon algorithm as your baseline, in under in under a minute. It’s crazy. Like, what a difference that it makes you to the business. So, you know, yeah, look at you know, I think we’ve got some learnings with with with with ChatGPT, and how do we get it to perform that I can share. And then we can talk about how we’ve integrated.
 
Ben Donovan  22:37
Yeah, no, let’s do it. Because you made a big claim there to be able to write a draft of a listing and under a minute, and I’ve you made little zoom, Zoom loom for me, kind of show me through it. And I was like, that’s pretty insane. So I do want everybody to see and hear this. So, so yeah, let’s, let’s make it happen. Yeah,
 
Jon Tilley  22:55
yeah, it’s a pretty big claim. But it’s true. That so we’ll do it live in a second. And you know, every time is different, so I think I’m headed once or twice where I’ve made a claim, and then the AIS come back, I’m like, oh, yeah, look, you know, the beauty of, of why it works well, within our tool is AI, and the quality of the outputs, or what it’s doing is based on the quality of the inputs, right. And so we’re, we’re, we’re prompting the AI the ChatGPT with, with quality data that is difficult to, to get together, right? So so the kinds of things we’re doing is if you want to write a product listing for your, your acent on Amazon, you know, you need to feed, you know, you have to write a piece of content with the right keywords. So finding the right keywords that are most relevant for your product that are that are that I’m that I’m, you know, cut out all the non relevant terms, but but are finding things that not only work for the Amazon algorithm, but the customers are actually typing to Amazon, those kinds of things. So from our keyword, toolkit was on fire, we can generate the right keywords. So we prompt the AR with the keywords, we also prompted with I’d say 50/50 on this because we prompted with with product awareness. So giving the AI awareness, but we have actually a we finessing that because that’s one of the biggest pieces that we’re trying to get really right with with the with the AI you know, being able to tell it that it’s like it’s a metal travel tumbler versus the wooden travel tumbler you know, that makes difference in how hard creates the content. So product awareness is important. The the content from the best converting listings on Amazon is is critical. Like what are the best listings on Amazon and can we can we tell the AI Hey, this is your realm and what does that look like within that niche that’s critical we feeling that the order of contents you Important sentiment, customer sentiment that we can get from, from product reviews, we’re starting to introduce that right? Understanding what people really love or hate, which we ever talk or love hate, so pulls out the customer sentiment, what are they really care about? Right? So can we can we give it that sentiment around the actual, you know, bullets that he’s writing around the benefits of the product, that’s critical. And then the order of how we prompt it, and, and not overloading it too much as well. Because if you give it too much information, it’s, you know, the same thing as anything, if you give it too much information, it can go a little haywire, right? So getting that balance, right. So that’s all the kind of work that we’ve done on our side. And then finally, obviously, structuring in a way that it writes it, you know, in the right way, you know, the right structure for an Amazon listing, you know, you know, and putting your main keywords in your title, followed by your bullets, your back in searches, etc. So that the content is, you know, if it’s going to convert from a sale, it’s it’s working best with Amazon algorithm. So that’s all the intelligence that we have. And we feed that into the AI and then it’s like, Yep, no problem. Here you go. And it gives a unique piece of content back, that at right now, what we’re seeing is, and I’ll show you this in our tool, but we we built our tool in a way in a way to give you context for listening. So when I say context, we allow you to optimize and get a score for for the content you’re creating, versus the keywords that you want to optimize for, in context of the other listings, on page one that are optimized for that keyword. And we allow you to pull in different listings and score those as well. So you know, right now, what we’re seeing is about a 30%, improvement of the the optimized optimization score of the ChatGPT output versus the best listings on page one. So from the, from the get from the, from the get go, you’re getting a well optimized piece of content in under a minute, that is better optimized for keywords than the main listing on page one, you know, so it’s a starting, if that’s your baseline, and under a minutes, I mean, you can only go up from there. So it’s, it is a game changer. And it’s, you know, it’s an itch that we all want to scratch. And we’ve been able to do it in our tool for a while. But it’s like, when I create a listing as a seller and I put it up on Amazon, is that maximizing my potential for for getting awareness for my product on an Amazon algorithm? And if so, how do I know that and being able to score that based on the algorithm that we have and intelligence, but also being able to compare that to other listings that scratches that itch, you can go okay, I’m better than you know, if this guy is selling number one on Amazon for this term, and my listing is better optimized. And here’s like, I’ve done a pretty good job, right? I can I can focus on my PPC or my sponsored ads or outbound traffic or whatever else I want to do.
 
Ben Donovan  27:51
Yeah, nice. Nice. Let’s take a look. Because I think there’ll be listening a lot of people listening that are really keen to see this in action. Like you said, I think that the obviously you forming sentences and copyrights, etc, is a challenge. But also, how do I fit all these keywords in and make it sound natural, and there’s so many things that if you’re trying to do this manually, can be a challenge. So this is going to, you know, I’m sure be a big help for a lot of people.
 
Jon Tilley  28:17
Sure. Can you see my screen? Yep. Great. This is just as long good just just logging in and showing you this is actually a live demo that you’re going to interact with on our main website. But this is I’m on my normal small Mac screen right now. But this is our dashboard. And these are all the tools that you can access, right. And you can see there’s no highlight over here for ChatGPT which is the new tool. Just one quick plug, actually, today, we’re launching this little section down here called the daily traffic, which is it’s pretty special for sellers, which is giving you the overall sessions and conversion percentage across your products or for specific products, and are also breaking down by mobile and desktop. And, you know, this is this is the mecca of what we do as sellers, which is trying to understand how much traffic are we getting to our listing pages, and of that traffic, what does it convert like, and you can get this inside of Seller Central, but it’s kind of hard to see trends. And you know, it’s been notoriously difficult to get hold of so this is live. So just a quick plug on that. But I’m going to jump over and show you inside of our listing optimization tools. This is listing optimizer, and the example I’m gonna show you is golf cooler. So, you know, golf cooler, it’s a pretty interesting product that you can sell as a private label seller. And what I’ve done, I’m not going to go into the background of this, but this this tool, the way it’s it’s showcased from a visual perspective is on the left hand side, you load the most important keywords that you want to optimize for for your Amazon listing. And you can load it from our keyword tool, which does an extremely good job on finding those keywords, but you can also add your keywords manually or from any The other list that you want. And so you would add those keywords and on the right hand side, you can add up to eight different listings. And, and what that means is you can add competitor listings. So you can just go you’re typing golf cooler into Amazon and you can copy the ACE and then you can load it somebody here. Typically, what I would do is load the best listing on page one, maybe the middle of page one, and maybe the best brand analytics, converting one, whatever you want, you can load them here, that’s, that doesn’t influence the AI. But it’s just a comparison, you look at how well they optimized for the keywords. And then you can actually, you know, create one of your listings from scratch. And you can do that from scratch, or you can import from a listing you already have already or you can do it from AI. So I’m just going to show you what it looks like the listing I’ve added guys, this one is frost blocks gold bag is actually the number one organic listing. Yeah, and you can see it we put in the title, we put in all of the bullets, we put in a description, and we actually put in the backend search terms, which is pretty unique. As a tool, we can we can show the back end search terms for any listing. So I’ve got that one and uphold Athletica, which is the middle of page one. So if I go ahead and import keywords, I’m going to do it from our tool. And I’ve got a save session here on on a golf cooler. And I’ll just add all the keywords, let’s just do that. And I load the keywords what what I’m doing right now is adding the most relevant keywords for golf cooler, and all the different types of search terms that that customers will search for it gives the keyword search volume, etc. And where to add in the listing exact match, broad match somewhere in the listing, and then you get an optimization score. So you can see right now, prospects golf bag cooler as score of almost 30,000, which is based on how well it’s optimized for these keywords. And it’s in the top 10% of all listings for the term Gulf crude. So it’s a well optimized listing. The other one here is average, right, it’s 15,000 is average. And you can see all the keywords that are in the listing and also the ones that are missing the highlighted green keywords are actually due to missing from the listing here, you can see sleeves, etc, right? I added all the keywords. So you know, you can see right, right from the get go have, you know, the goal to match is around 30,000, if you can prove that you’re a pretty well optimized listing. And I can go here on the right hand side, and I can click here give me you know, again, I can do it from scratch one of my products, or I can actually start from a competitor listing of one or AI generated, so I’m clicking on AI generated. And I’ll just say Add to listing. And so real time right now what it’s doing. And sometimes we shared the screen, it takes a little bit longer, but real time we feeding the AI again with all the keywords that we have loaded on the left hand side, which which our tool takes those keywords and then looks at the whole niche book for golf cooler, golf cooler bag, and then and then it feeds those, it also looks at the top converting listings for that term, or also looks at product awareness. And, and and a few other things that we feeding it with to generate the listing and then you know, within within 30 seconds under a minutes it’s going to generate a listing and we’ll see how it scores again, every time we generate a listing, it’s going to be different because you creating unique content that is that is, you know, optimized for those terms. So typically, it’s about a 30% improvement over some of the businesses on page one. And sometimes sometimes not. So often we’ll see what comes up,
 
Ben Donovan  33:31
I suppose that may be the concern for some sellers is, hey, if we’re using this, and we’re taking other listings as our source, am I going to get dinged for, you know, copying the content? Are there going to be any issues there? But you’re saying this sort of completely unique content?
 
Jon Tilley  33:47
Yes. So far, you know, and that’s a good question. I’m, you know, this always happens, I don’t know why it’s taking so long to generate
 
Ben Donovan  33:55
your write on the screen sharing it to someone seems to slow down computers massively. It’s frustrating.
 
Jon Tilley  34:01
Unless I logged out, I did something interesting. So what we’ll see what, what happens if we actually get there? So yeah, the question that is interesting, like, is there a pager as of right, you know, is the is the AI actually writing unique content? You know, what, what, you know, is there a way to check it is it being used by by, you know, is a copying from from other listings? And, you know, so far from what we’re seeing in our testing, and we have a tool called IP monitoring, and we’ve tested it against the, you know, we don’t find that it’s that it’s actually, you know, copied, you know, plagiarism or anything like that. But I think the point is, at the end of the day, you know, you’re doing an injustice to yourself, if you just literally, you know, I generated this thing and posted it, you’re not going to do that you’re going to take it as a baseline and you’re going to finesse it further, because one of the bullets might not make sense. You might want to tweak it, you want to move it up so you’re going to get your new content regardless Um, so we’ve gotten a listing generated. And you can see the score right off the bat there is 32,000. So it’s a higher optimized score than the best listing on page one. It’s in the top 7%. And you can see he has, he has the listing, right, so, golf cooler bag viously, for golf bag, insulated, soft golf cart cooler, you know, it’s written in a way that we understand as Amazon sellers. Yeah, we’re finishing this further. But for volunteers versus a well optimized headline headline that is not overstuffed, but also has really good exact phrase, matching and a title. The bullets we start with the benefit, stay hydrated, dash explains that this intake, gold cooler, etcetera, convenience protection design, it has a bullet, you know, as a description that written and we don’t populate the backend search. So we’ll leave that up to you. And there’s a way I can show you just to add that in a second. But if you don’t like any of these, you can also just simply hit the AI generated within that specific thing. So if the title doesn’t make sense for you, you can regenerate that title. And then if you want to add the backend search terms, I can just go here and add all the backend search terms, let’s add them. These are all the D dupe keywords we haven’t used yet in the listing. And I’ve got a score of 40,000 in the top 3%. So you can imagine as a baseline in under a minute, or that took a little bit longer sharing here, but but you’ve got a listing now that you can now go in, and you could physically edit it within the tool, make sure that it brings in your creativity, your expertise, your brand tone, if you want, and then you can go ahead when you’re happy with it, and you can publish it directly to Amazon. So we if you’re connected within our tool, it’s a flat file upload, and it literally publishes directly to Amazon, and then you can move on to your next listing. So, you know, at the end of the day, how this helps you as you you’ve got well, you know, important quality keywords that you added that you know, you should be optimizing for, you’ve got a well read and listing in under a minute that you can then edit further, you know, the job listing scores as good or better than your main competitors. And you can upload it to Amazon, and then you can feel confident that you have a good, good baseline you can move on to everything else that you need to do. Right. So it’s pretty significant. Yeah.
 
Ben Donovan  37:15
Yes, it’s crazy. And the direct upload to Amazon as well as like, could you make it any easier? That’s crazy. So if everyone can use on Guru, obviously, we’ll leave a link to Zon Guru. In in the description below. Anyone could go and access that today. Right. So that sets the baseline of what is possible. You know, it lowers I suppose the barrier to entry to a highly optimized Amazon listing. So what can sellers then do to make sure they continue to stand out because previously, a well optimized listing with keywords, the right keywords in the right places that was going to make you stand out to an under optimized listing, as more and more people do this, and I recognize not everyone, as much as you’d like them to not every single Amazon seller is going to get a longer subscription. So it’s not going to be everyone. But as it gets easier to create higher quality listings, how can Amazon sellers continue to create, you know, better listings? How do you see that we’ll go in?
 
Jon Tilley  38:15
Yeah, but and by the way, we are in beta right now. And in order to access the the ChatGPT integration, you need to either be an existing customer, or you just sign up through our preferred partners link. So Ben, obviously, you’ve got that. So you know, people need to sign up through that link, not just through the general zonguru.com link to get access to the beta. And it’s free as part of your subscription. So we’re not charging we’re we’re absorbing that that fee from ChatGPT. Yeah, to get to Yeah. Again, I think going back to the initial part of our discussion, what technology is doing is pushing us as individuals to focus on our craft and focus on our creativity, right, and, and this is just going to push us to be better at that, right? When you when you’re writing a listing, you’re writing it not just for the algorithm, you’re not writing it just to beat your competitors, but you’re writing it to connect with your customer. And that’s the part that you truly have to focus on. Now, you have a well written listing that, you know, is optimized for the right keywords, but what do you say in those bullets? How you say it, what benefits are you putting out, you know, how does that connect with the imagery that you do with the overlays, you know, with all of those pieces, that you know, there’s still a lot to be done there. And, and not missing out anything on the buyers journey, right? And what are the significant things to a seller so there’s a lot of that stuff that that you still have to do. And, and a lot of ways to, to kind of still connect with the customer. One thing that I always recommend sellers to do is to actually go through a buyer journey exercise with with your target audience and a way that, you know, I’ve simply told people to do that is literally a loom video Get someone to go in and buy a product in your category and record their buy experience and the questions they’ll ask themselves in buying that and you will 100% find holes in in, you know, when they’re trying to find something to to buy, and they’re going through listings, they’re looking for specifics that will make the buying decision better. Every listing is going to be missing stuff. And if you can capture those, and are certainly not going to capture those, you know, you will stand out and get better conversion. So it’s just pushing us to be stronger on the things that really matter. Taking care of the the basic things that we need to take care of.
 
Ben Donovan  40:35
Yeah, yeah, it’s exciting times for entrepreneurs for Amazon sellers. Exciting times was longer way to you, without obviously giving away all your all your secrets. Where do you see this going? What have you got planned? How’s this going to develop for Zon Guru?
 
Jon Tilley  40:51
Yeah, I mean, it’s, you know, we’re obviously the first, we’re definitely the first in the space that’s launched this, we’re not going to be the only but you know, it’s about iterating on that. And we actually, I think next week, we come out with our version two of the beta. And you know, the things that we’re already including that are going to be language, which is a pretty powerful piece writers is being able to do this listing optimization in French versus English. And so far from our testing, and we actually have specific, multi language agencies that are giving us feedback on the copy, you see, how does it actually look? And there’s a lot of content in the space around language. But ChatGBT does an excellent job on language. Right? So yeah, there’s another super cool feature that’s gonna be coming out. tonality, you know, do you want something written in a salesy way for the American market? Or do you want something written in a pretty straightforward non salesy way for the German market? Or is your brand friend or professional or whatever? So, being able to give the AI cues around? How you want that written? Do you know, you know, people do it today? They, they say, Hey, write me, you know, you do this and tell me tells me in a jokey way or whatever, you will do it, right.
 
Ben Donovan  42:12
The experience of a five year old Yeah,
 
Jon Tilley  42:14
yeah, exactly. It’s pretty fun. Yeah. So you know, so those are things that are coming out mostly as product awareness and getting it to truly focus, we’re giving it customized fields, so you can, you can give it a lot more waiting around what you want to focus on. And then we have a whole bunch of iterations coming around around our listing optimization tool in general, and keywords, etc. So it’s pretty exciting times, I think, you know, look, for us as a business. You know, we’re competing in a extremely competitive space. And the challenge for us is also we, you know, we have a lot of tools. So, you know, picking a unique value proposition to bring across, it’s somewhat difficult because you’ve got tools that helping in different areas. You know, what ChatGPT is doing for us right now. It’s, it’s helping us get in the door with some conversations. And then we can showcase all of the tools that we have. And, you know, when when we get in front of the audience, and we showed people, I’m blown away by our tool set. So yeah, it’s a, it’s a it’s a good time. And it’s a very busy time right now. But we’re just riding the bandwagon and keep going with us. Right. And again, you know, we have a seller DNA and everything we do is there to help sellers. And this is absolutely healthy. It’s something that can help you as a seller, and overall to help us all right, so it’s certainly something to get in and use. And even if you just sign up for a trial, and you and you test, you can load your listing that you currently have, and run ChatGPT against and and see how does it do in comparison to your current listing? Like that’s a test with doing right and seeing, you know, what’s the best way to optimize my keywords? Definitely. worth trying. Yeah,
 
Ben Donovan  43:56
yeah, for sure. No, I love the way you and the team and Zon Guru innovate. I think there’s a real streak of entrepreneurialism. It’s not just a software tool to be a software tool. It’s there’s innovation, entrepreneurialism, and I love that about you guys. So I’m not surprised to see you guys released this first and innovate in this way. And excited to see that all you do. Appreciate you taking time out. John, I know you must be busy with everything going on. And and it’s Valentine’s Day today, as you said, so I’m sure you got lots of things to do today so I’ll let you get back to it. But well, obviously we’ll leave a link to Zon Guru in the description, like we said through that link, people can sign up for the beta can get involved in GPT. The the kind of the Yeah, the AI side of Zon Guru, which is super exciting. Anything else you want to add for our listeners before we finish the show?
 
Jon Tilley  44:51
Like just, you know, give it give it a test. If you have any questions, you know, hit us up on our website or you know, we have a passionate team here that wants to help you And I’ll give you everything you need. So if you feeling like, you need a little help, just jump into my support and the team can help you there.
 
Ben Donovan  45:07
Yeah, there are a great team dealt with a whole bunch of young guys and they are all amazing. So definitely can vouch for that. Amazing guys, thank you so much for listening to the show today. Exciting times with AI selling on Amazon. A new future awaits us, grab a hold of it, make some money, make some impact. It’s going to be super exciting. Thanks for listening to the show today. Check out out Zon Guru description down below in the description down below. Give it a spin. See how you go optimize those listings and we’ll see in the next episode real soon.